Sanofi ending its Afrezza partnership with Mannkind


#123

^^^^^ that’s a really important reason! The inhalers (dreamboat and cricket) don’t appear to have any partner potential for the other suggested applications for them:
•Pain
•Migraine
•Anti-nausea
•Anti-obesity
•Osteoporosis
•GI disorder
•Pulmonary arterial hypertension
•Immunosuppression
•Vaccination
•Respiratory disorder
•Adjuvant therapy
•Reconstituted powders

I would love to tour the location where all they do is manufacture Afrezza Inhaler.


#124

Karen, where do I begin? Small biotechs INVENT drugs or advances or cures. Small biotechs CANNOT market and distribute their own drugs or cures. They are not a sales, marketing and distribution company. They MUST choose one of the big pharmaceutical companies to market, sell and distribute their findings. Name ONE small biotech who marketed a drug directly. Small biotechs usually spend all their money inventing a drug. By the time they drug gets past the FDA (Mannkind’s first big mistake; this should have been marketed ANYWHERE but the U S of A) they ALWAYS need a partner to market the drug. Now, if a new drug has been invented that does not threaten the profits these big pharmaceuticals are making off their existing treatments or if any entirely new class of drug is invented, you will see it. The problem with insulin is three big pharma companies sell their own and they are making billions off their own products. And a pharma company doesn’t even have to make their own insulin to scuttle a new insulin. The HUGE Type 2 market has oral drugs and other injectables these companies make billions on. Hence the exhilaration we all felt when Dr. Zion’s SMARTINSULIN was purchased by Merck was short lived. SMARTINSULIN threatened Mercks Januvia.which they were making mucho dinero on. So Merck sat on SMARTINSULIN for five years, so they could milk the Type 2 market. SMARTINSULIN is really almost as good as a cure if it works in humans the way it works in animal studies. Will it get to market? Maybe. But in its own good time and mainly because others are inventing a SMARTINSULIN. Big Pharma will do everything in it’s power, though, once it has been invented to scuttle, delay, prevent this drug from gaining hold. Something has to change. I’m not naive. This is not just about Sanofi. It’s just that my DD has been using Afrezza for a very short time, it has changed and improved her live immensely, So what Sanofi did to Afrezza hits me in the gut and makes me very angry because for me this is PERSONAL.


#125

Karen, I see now you are bashing the inhaler. Al Mann invented Afrezza for diabetics, just as Al Mann invented the insulin pump for diabetics, just as Al Mann invented the portable defribulator for cardiac patients, just as Al Mann is in the process of inventing a device to help the blind see, just as Al Mann is in the process of helping paralyzed patients walk again. Al Mann’s main purpose was to bring Afrezza to market to help diabetics just as he had before with the Minimed pump. He sunk almost a billion dollars into Afrezza and he is now 90. He’s an engineer. My father was an engineer. Engineers think scientifically, not emotionally. You can’t just tell them something, they have to observe it, test it scientifically, see if it works in real life. Al Mann knows Afrezza works in real life. Al Mann is a philanthropist. His motive has never been greed. It has never been profit. .The inhaler device was never his primary product. Mannkind is a small biotech which cannot market and distribute it’s own products. That’s why they gave Sanofi 65% of their future profits to market BOTH Afrezza and the inhaler. You are VERY INTERESTED in the failure of Mannkind, though, although you don’t use Afrezza yourself. But before you start bashing Al Mann’s products, look down at your own body and realize you are wearing an insulin pump that this genious created. Please don’t now bash his company after all he has done for you.


#126

[quote=“Julia61, post:125, topic:50253”]But before you start bashing Al Mann’s products, look down at your own body and realize you are wearing an insulin pump that this genious created. Please don’t now bash his company after all he has done for you.
[/quote]Julia, I wrote this in your grateful thread:
I am also very grateful to Alfred Mann for establishing MiniMed!! I love my pump, and I can manage my bg just fine with it. No need for additional insulin products.

I am not bashing any product. I think Alfred Mann is going to be okay and I think he is brilliant. I was trying to defend injected inulin and share some facts about this gig sans emotions.


#127

Karen,

I don’t think anyone is bashing injected insulin. I certainly am not. Just because I’m enjoying success with Afrezza (and sharing it), it does not mean that I think injected insulin is bad by any means and hopefully you aren’t taking it that way. I still use injected insulin via a pump.

It’s hard not to be emotional when something like this comes along, impacts your life in such a substantive way and can potentially be taken away.


#129

[quote=“mikep, post:127, topic:50253, full:true”]
Karen,

I don’t think anyone is bashing injected insulin. I certainly am not. Just because I’m enjoying success with Afrezza (and sharing it), it does not mean that I think injected insulin is bad by any means and hopefully you aren’t taking it that way. I still use injected insulin via a pump.

It’s hard not to be emotional when something like this comes along, impacts your life in such a substantive way and can potentially be taken away.
[/quote]Thanks, Mike. Afrezza is simply not an option for me and I am ever glad that it works so well for folks that can get it and that can use it successfully. I don’t have any issues with the maker the marketer or the product. My interest in this topic is helping folks understand why the product is having troubles. And now I have learned that it is prescribed to a child and the label clearly states “it is not known if Afrezza® is safe and effective in children under 18 years of age.”

There are many reasons why this product is having trouble reaching the diabetics who can and want to use it. I’ll keep my fingers crossed for ya, but I’m not adding MNKND to my portfolio :wink:


#130

If you’re referring to Juila’s child, I believe she’s well past 18. I’d have to dig back through her posts to be sure, so I reserve the right to be wrong. Once your Child always your Child, age is just a #.


#131

Yes, Julia’s DD is in college so probably not a “child” by definition. I read a lot…even outside of TuD.


#133

Karen, I have taken issue with you because this brilliant and philanthropic man whose inventions have helped diabetics, cardiac patients, patients with spinal cord injuries and lately the blind, has selflessly poured a billion dollars of his own money into Afrezza to help us, money he will never get back to once again help diabetics. And a lot of diabetics are bashing his invention. Have they tried it? No! And they should not try it if they are not interested. But they should ask questions from those who have used it and keep an open mind. Sanofi and probably all the pharma companies are in this business to MAKE MONEY, not give it away like Al Mann. And give it away he does. Selflessly. Your worry that if Afrezza takes off, injected insulin would be harder to get is groundless. As you know, all Type 1s need a basal insulin through injection or pump. Afrezza is a great bolus insulin and brings highs down within an hour. Other insulins cannot do this as they don’t peak until an hour and a half and take from 3 to 5 hours to stop working. Which can be quite dangerous. Al Mann recognized this and invented Afrezza to help us. You don’t have to try it. But when a large drug company who is in court defending itself against scuttling Lemtrada (I think?) a drug for multiple sclerosis, “partnering” with that company and losing them millions, not promoting it because they were supporting another drug due out in a year, they can be sued for their actions. And they are in court once again; Sanofi has been sued a lot. These drug companies know EXACTLY how much your disease profits them, yearly to the penny. And Sanofi has Apidra and a new injectable coming out now… They bought Afrezza to scuttle the competition. That’s what Mannkind “owes” Sanofi. So when a drug, with the potential to help people the world over is sandbagged, skuttled, walked into bankruptcy, we need to care. Even if we don’t use the drug. These are serious diseases and they are playing with lives here.


#134

[quote=“Julia61, post:133, topic:50253”]
Your worry that if Afrezza takes off, injected insulin would be harder to get is groundless.
[/quote]??? I never said anything like this. You taking issue with me is just annoying now. No one is “bashing” anyone here except for you, Julia. I have said a number of times that I am happy for those who can use Afrezza. And that I am grateful for the pump product I wear. Why do you continue to instigate a fight over this gig. Don’t use Sanofi stuffs - it’s okay with me if you don’t! LOL


#135

#136

#137

Why, for the love of diabetes support groups, do these Mannkind/Sanofi/Afrezza threads keep getting closed and then re-opened?!?!?

We are [almost] all adults here. Whenever I’ve seen anyone respond in an affectively-charged or downright inappropriate manner (and I admit that I am guilty of having done this on occasion!) other members inevitably/invariably call them out. I don’t like it when I see that threads are closed for this reason.

However, I have absolutely no qualms about threads being shut down when they contain repeated statements that are clearly sexist, racist, or homophobic. And by all means PLEASE close threads that make false claims about cures or threads that blame Type 2s for causing their diabetes!


#138

It was @Sam19 who said this, not @karen57. It’s what made me jump in to the conversation, because the idea that Afrezza as the be all, end all in insulin and could halt the progress of future developments in injected insulin is not good for the millions of people who can’t (or may not want to) use it.


#139

That’s not what I meant to say— Jen, the point I was trying to make is that I believe that a new and innovative treatment as effective as this threatens the business model of the big established pharma and that I believe they are rightfully threatened by it and would do whatever it takes to ensure it doesn’t replace the market share of their dominant last generation insulins (this would apply whether it’s injected, inhaled, swallowed, or however else it might be administered). Nobody is suggesting that injected insulin won’t be around forever or continue to be improved upon. I’ve currently been writing reviews on a new injected insulin that I’m quickly becoming a huge fan of… My life depends on injected insulin as well… It is here to stay and if they could make an injected bolus work this well I’d be just as excited about it.


#140

Thanks for the clarification. I was just clarifying why I (and maybe some others, though I can’t speak for them) comment on these types of threads even though we don’t use Afrezza ourselves.

I hope that both inhaled and injected insulin (and maybe some other options) continue to stick around for the long term and continue to be improved upon.


#141

I cannot get the nerve to inject interveinously bi can start to look for a vein then I freak out


#142

Let’s compare the terms of the Toujeo Savings Card with those of the Afrezza Savings Card:

Toujeo Savings Card

Savings Card carries maximum savings of $500 off per pack for the duration of the program.

Afrezza Savings Card

https://www.afrezza.com/save-on-afrezza

Maximum benefit is $150 off per prescription depending on your out-of-pocket costs for the duration of the program.

Wow, how did Sanofi envision Afrezza to be competitive with these kind of pricing strategy?


#143

I’ll not deny that Sanofi could have (should have?) done more to market Afrezza; however, I think this issue is dependent on their understanding of insurance coverage. I realize that neither one has sufficient insurance coverage, but Toujeo is still newer than Afrezza, so likely has even fewer choices.

Notably, when I had it, the savings card for Apidra was also limited to $150 off per prescription. I don’t think Sanofi wants to bury Apidra.


#144

Thas, thanks for the input. That’s very informative. For the Apidra savings card, when was that? Perhaps the price of prescription drugs have gone up a lot since then. Plus, Sanofi priced Afrezza at a significant premium over RAAs.