Research on Fat Shaming

@alex:
Clap. Clap clap. Bravo bravo, Mr.PerfectExampleofaHumanBeing.

Now please elaborate on the difference between fat-shaming and non-acceptance of fat?

Smartalex1972.....Current research is finding that insulin resistance happens first and causes weight gain. Your lack of tolerance is an interesting take on a difficult condition. Fat people are usually kind of used to being harshly judged by others, as are most smokers. Being judgemental doesn't help anyone, either.....Blessings

I never claimed to be perfect. I claimed to not be obese.

I don't really see any difference between fat shaming and non acceptance of fatness. What's your point? "Fat acceptance" is an attempt by obese people to avoid taking responsibility for their own actions and to blame someone or something else for their fatness. No amount of acceptance will make obesity healthy or attractive.

Look, Type 1 and Type 2 diabetes are not the same. Those of us who live with Type 1 are not compatriots of people who live with Type 2. We do not have the same issues. Fat people with Type 2 diabetes bring it on themselves whereas those of us with Type 1 do not.

It also increases red cell count, strengthens the immune system, and a dozen or so other good things. It's a cliché, but . . . "if exercise were a pill you could take, it would be the most-prescribed medication in the world."

@alex:
This discussion centres around a scholarly research article indicating fat-shaming (regardless of the moral sensibilities) is a particularly ineffective tool for bringing about weight loss.



I understand well the frustrations of Type 1 Diabetes. But there are better places too air it. And much more deserving targets for the spread of misinformation.

We have a Values Statement here, which I encourage you to read. quoting from part of it

"A note about the different types of diabetes: We believe that no one with diabetes is responsible for having this condition, and we do not support debates about "which type is worse" or comments which place blame on anyone for their condition. The different types of diabetes have more similarities than differences, and within this community we focus on our commonalities and the ways in which we can all support one another as a unified group."

I also encourage you to watch this video of a TED talk by Peter Attia, it certainly changed my point of view, and backs up Judith's comment.

As was pointed out above, present research is increasingly calling into question the traditional assumption that obesity causes insulin resistance.

I am T2. I am not obese and never was. My BMI is in the low 20s and has been as far back as I can remember.

Nevertheless, after 17 years of burning out my beta cells with sulfonylureas, my c-pep is now less than 0.3 and I am completely insulin dependent. In point of actual fact I do deal with many of the same issues as a T1: I risk hyperglycemia if I miss one of my twice-daily basals or fail to accurately match insulin to food, and hypoglycemia if I "match" it a bit too well, or wait too long to eat. I keep a glucagon kit handy and available, and I keep it current, replacing it when it expires.

The Joslin Center now starts all T2s on insulin right away. Conceivably they know something.

"If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem." Stereotypes are not part of the solution.

TuDiabetes founder Manny Hernandez covers this subject perfectly HERE and HERE.

I would just add that until the diabetes community learns to speak with a single voice, we will NEVER receive the legislative or financial support that other causes do.

I would like to think an important goal of our community at TuDiabetes is bring everybody who has diabetes together to help dispel misconceptions. And before we can hope to deal with this in the media and in public, we have to deal with it in our own community. Yes, having Type 2 diabetes can cause you to gain weight as your body becomes insulin resistant and you overproduce insulin. And someone with Type 1 can gain weight as exogenous insulin acts to cause our bodies to accumulate fat. But that doesn't mean that someone with T2 overeats and is a sloth and causes their condition and it isn't that someone with T1 causes themselves to struggle with weight. That is just an unfair and unhelpful comment. I have sympathy for everyone in this situation.

My biggest hope is that smartalex1972 hangs around to talk about this.

Without repeating what Marie and David have said I wish to address what Alex has said and explain why we at Tud do not support his statements.

TuD exist so the no diabetic will feel alone, we include and embrace all PWD and know that blame and shame is no way to support someone.

I am T2 and I realize that weight loss is a key part of the treatment for an overweight T2, heck I lost weight and it was good for me but I cannot for the life of me blame someone, the jury is still out and we just do not know the cause.

I also cannot write someone's life off because of some perceived blame. I could not forsake someone with excess weight any more than I could some someone with cancer.

If you wish to blame something blame the addictive cigarette not the smoker, blame the T2 as a disease not the person that suffers the disease.

That is an excellent video to raise in light of smartalex1972's misunderstanding of the facts. Peter Attia, already a doctor at the beginning of his career, comes to painfully appreciate the ignorance of his initial take on T2D. Right on point, Marie. I only hope this commenter is honest enough with himself to view it. He is certainly not alone in this flawed view of reality.

Agreed. From his wall, Alex comes off good natured and a person with sensible ideas. I hope he continues to participate here at Tudiabetes too.



I continue to disagree with the simplicity of Alex’s premises on Type 2 and obesity. I responded protectively and off the cuff at first. Too often that type of statement stymies productive discussion.



But, he’s human like the rest of us, with all the pluses and minuses of the condition. Sometimes I too long for a less murky and complex world with easily defined heroes and bad guys
fewer shades of grey. But we live in this one. Oversimplifying leads to confusion, fear, and misunderstandings.



Thanks to all who responded with clear, non-judgemental data and food for thought. I’ve learned things today. Thank you Alex for posting a response to my question. I don’t have to agree with you to value the opportunity to understand a little more clearly where you’re coming from.



You’ve provided the perfect backdrop to share a wealth of thoughts and personal experiences on the matter which might, otherwise, might have gone unspoken.

In the game, Boal says that the oppressor who was once oppressed soon learns that his role as oppressor is temporary; at any moment, he may become one of the oppressed once again.

What I hear is the fear: fear of being victimized, of being lumped into the group who supposedly deserve to be victimized; fear of a disease that can kill and maim; fear that even with the most precise calibration and calculation things can still go wrong; fear that it could happen to me. Becoming the oppressor isn't the answer because bullying reassures the oppressor for only a short time before the waves of fear flood back.

Rather we must each of us consciously resolve not to become an oppressor, but to fight oppression whenever we find it. TuDiabetes and this thread specifically are helping to do that.

This rationale makes a lot of sense.

fear of a disease that can kill and maim; fear that even with the most precise calibration and calculation things can still go wrong; fear that it could happen to me.

This is a fear that we all must address. And it never totally goes away.

As I have recently pointed out in a blog, I am a 40 year Type 1 diabetic. I was also externally overweight

http://www.tudiabetes.org/profiles/blogs/gone-but-for-a-good-reason

and I had to lose 100+ pounds. Weight gain or loss is not an issue limited to type 2 diabetics. Being smug about weight loss or gain or thinking that weight is a type issue is, well it is not appropriate (I had other words but chose this one).

The thing here is that we have standards and as Marie points out, it is appropriate to abide by those standards. I personally think a full review to make sure this is the correct community for posters is very important. I hope those suggesting that type 2's have brought diabetes on themselves especially consider if their beliefs can be reconciled with the community at large.

This is a fundamental statement for participation..................... rick

i was overweight, not obese, and prediabetic. i went from 145lb.to 128 lb (at 5'3") and my A1c went from 5.9 to 5.6. last year i was around 6 - 8 pounds heavier, but my A1c was better: 5.3, as i was eating higher fat, lower carb.

1. so losing weight doesn't directly correlate with better blood sugar.

there are a lot of obese people who never get diabetes.

2. you need a genetic predisposition. both my parents have it and i have one risk allele for the TCF7L2 gene. polymorphisms in this gene are the most predictive ones for type 2 studied to date.

3. my brother is a farmer who works like a dog all day doing heavy manual labor. he is obese. activity doesn't always translate to weight loss. sure i tell him to eat low carb, and he doesn't, but you, alex, sure couldn't call him lazy.

4. i am now normal weight, but i still can't handle the carb load my husband can, who has no diabetes in his family. i'm just trying to delay or avoid getting to diabetic bg levels altogether, and at present I take no medication or insulin. if one day, even exercising and eating low carb, i hit the critereia for diabetes, will you blame me, alex?

You know, this is really unfortunate because I was beginning to have a slight bit of hope on this website that I could finally be accepted somehow and not blamed for this disease. Now I'm just seeing that the world really is like this outside of the PW(type 2)D group. Most people just hide their contempt better.

Nobody wants to be overweight and nobody wants to have diabetes. The amount of shame and self-hatred I have about this is more than you can understand. I'm often suicidal about it and seeing someone actually say these things is just unbelievably horrifying. You say you don't even like to be compared with us. Imagine how it must feel to BE us.

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Growing up I was the fat kid in my family and as such I heard it all from my family. So, when I joined the D family at forty my mom’s words were " O Denny you need to stop eating sweets". As a result we don’t talk about my diabetes much. Thank God for mercy and forgiveness.

to me, it don’t matter, if you fat or skinny, you are still a Great person,.

How unfortunate for your friend. It’s a poor way for that store to operate its business first off. That employee’s behavior was clearly disrespectful. Acceptance of people for any appearance is the most mature and professional behavior, regardless of the condition. The stigma around diabetes and obesity slows the understanding and hinders proper care for those in need.

Hi Angela,

I thought I might share this information regarding weight bias and stigma from the University of Connecticut and Yale University

This second link focuses on intrinsic biases pertaining to weight. I found it helpful to assess whether I had biases I was unaware of.

https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/Study?tid=-1

I hope it is helpful to you as well.

Jo