I know it is me again. But I have a serious problem that to me is blatently obvious and yet it seems to be the opposite of how most people eat and also diametrically opposed to what is recommended by gov’t health officials and most medical professionals. Here is a quote from my last post on http://www.three2treat.com
I asked a brand new, wet behind the ears Resident or Family Doc in Training how much education he received in the area of nutrition during his medical degree. His response was, “Hardly Any”
Hmmmmm. So I decided to pull a Medical Physiology Textbook written by Guyton from the shelf to have a look at what these doctors review in terms of Insulin Metabolism, and the storage of Macronutriants, like Carbohydrate, Protein, and fat. Thinking, there must be a profound reason we are offering the general public a guideline to consume a diet that contains 65% carbohydrate. So I flip it to the pertinent section. And read the following:
“In time, the insulin plays an important role in storing the excess energy substances. In the case of excess carbohydrate, it causes these to be stored as glycogen mainly in the liver and muscles. It causes fat storage in the adipose tissue. Also, all the excess carbohydrate that cannot be stored as glycogen are converted under the stimulus of insulin into fats also stored in the adipose tissue”
Okay, so they are taught in medical physiology that insulin is the main stimulus for fat storage. So I ask myself, what causes increased levels of insulin in the human body?
Source:
Textbook of Medical Physiology, Guyton, Arthur C.8th Edition, WB Saunders Company, 1991. pp. 858-859.
I am trying to figure this out. But the more I read I question if a calorie in is simply a just a calorie. There are studies, I will dig am up, but since I am suppose to be working it’ll have to way, that indicate a change in metobolic pathways when consuming particular macronutrients, as the Medical text suggests. Like when a person consumes 30 grams of CHO per day, it changes that metobolic pathway to favour fat as its primary fuel source, which is neat, and I have found it personally effective… Some of the evolutionary science behind eating is remarkable as well, and I just don’t think we were designed to eat excess CHO like most folks do. Looking forward to more discussion, but I have to do some work.
Gary Taubes has several books on the topic. One is called something like “Why we Get Fat?” And is quite a good read. Unfortunately I’m on my phone and don’t have it handy. He questions a lot of the “calories in/calories out” theory and explains how carbs are, in fact, the culprit and are not in fact necessary. This makes sense to me if only because carbs are a relatively recent development in human history.
I would agree that our bodies really are not meant to process very refined carbs. But I think Taubes and others put such an emphasis on what we eat/consume for the reason that some get fat, but not enough emphasis on how our sedentary lifestyles contribute to the problem. As you and I know, Mr AcidRock, lots of exercise is a “magic pill.”
Gary Taubes does not believe that a calorie is a calorie or calories in vs. calories out. If you examine closely the dietary guidelines, the 45-65% of calories from carbs comes from dietary surveys. They recommend that level of carbs because people report that is what they eat. So the recommendation is that people should eat what they have been eating, and with an epidemic of obesity that is clearly a bonehead thing to do.
Anything you eat will be stored as fat if you have eaten more calories than your body is able to burn. That includes carbohydrate and protein, but yes it also includes fat. Anyone who says otherwise is trying to make mega-money by selling books about fanciful magic diets. I include Taubes in this category.
Then how do you explain me loosing four inhes off my waist in 2 months eating 30-50 gms CHO per day, and the rest of my 2000 Calories come from fat and protein? I think some of the research is legit, never mind the fanatical diet book types. Pretty interesting stuff if you actually try it and experiment on your self. But you kinda have to be open minded for that…
An acquaintance of mine mentioned that “I’m 20 lbs overweight and the doctor said ‘cut back on the carbs’” the other day so perhaps the words are getting out?
Actually, this is my experience. I ate over 5,000 calories a day on a very low carb diet and didn’t gain any weight. Now granted, my weight is very stable, but still. If you really beleive calories in vs. calories out, I should have gained more than 50 lbs.
(slight sarcasm) Ah, but if the equation was so simple, we would all be thin, if we only exercised more. Then the fitness and diet industry would be out of business, because losing weight would be so easy.
Taubes suggests the exercise is immaterial. I think that it provides focus, happiness and a sense of accomplishment but I can’t remember what the argument was? I think something like if you exercise, you will likely eat more, which came up @ the running club this AM…“The Garmin tells you how many calories you can eat and drink later…”. Given the peculiar challenges of diabetes, I’ve been working on having less carbs and doing ok w/ it. Today I had a really nice result, 10 mile run w/ pretty flattish line and only about 20-30G of carbs to fuel it. The ExCarbs in Pumping Insulin, a book I like a lot, suggests more like 90? I was still cooking along @ a good pace for me @ the end of it and didn’t feel fatigued or anything like that.
Actually, what I think Taubes says is that exercise doesn’t support weight loss through calories in vs. calories out. I think he would agree exercise increases insulin sensitivity, increases metabolism and fitness supports overall health. In that way, exercise is certainly material.
One thing to consider as well, how much money does Big Agra stand to make if the dietary recommendations are in line with their business model? By having a diet of 55% grains, we WON’T be able to take off the weight, control our BG, so of course that fuels Big Pharma.
I agree with you, follow the money.
I agree. What he says in “Why We Get Fat” is that the harder you work, the more you eat. He cites a lumberjack as one example, eating 5000 calories per day vs tailors eating 2500 per day.
The point is moot though, calories in/calories out is worthless. It’s like saying the room gets fuller because more people go in than go out. Duh.
The point is what’s done with the calories, and how they are used. Are they stored energy, or are they used to fuel your daily activities?
Sorry Jag1 - another thing to poke a hole in your theory. If you look at the poverty levels in 3rd world countries, you find obese women who are not eating so their kids can eat. Yet, they are still getting fat. How do you account for this phenomenon using the statement, “Anything you eat will be stored as fat if you have eaten more calories than your body is able to burn?”
I think low carb/next-to-no-carb is great for managing diabetes as well as for weight loss.
Folks just have to have tours of their grocery stores to learn not to look at the “no sugar” stuff.
When I go to the cereal aisle, I pick up coffee & brown coffee filters.
When I go to the baking aisle, I pick up nuts & oil.
When I go to the rice aisle, I pick up tuna, chicken & salmon. mayo, vinegar.
When I go to the cold aisle, I pick up cream cheese, cottage cheese, Muenster cheese, and Dannon Diabetic Friendly.
When I go to the milk, it’s fat free.
When I go to the produce aisle, it’s watermelon, lettuce, blueberries, 1 banana/husband, broccoli, brussels sprouts, etc. etc.
When I go to the frozen food, it’s uncrusted salmon, tilapia, chicken, flounder, Morningstar sausages, and packages of spinach creamed.
So why would I need any of the other carbohydrates?
Guyton’s has been thrown away and the US Dept of Agriculture Nutritive Value of American Foods tells me what I need to know.
Most docs don’t have it cause they leave it to the dietitians. Look down the Carbohydrate column.
You don’t supply enough facts. How much do you weigh? How much exercise were you getting?
What do you think happened to the fat you were eating? Did it just disappear?
You have to be more than open-minded to believe you can eat unlimited fat and not gain weight - it’s a distinct benefit if you also believe in fairies.
Um, its not exactly my theory. Go to any library and open any medical textbook written in the last 100 years. So your theory is that people in 3rd world countries are fat because they’re not eating enough calories? Really? Have you really thought this through?
Your shopping list would not be acceptable if you were following the Bernstein low-carb diet.
Nuts should be avoided. Cottage cheese, Dannon diabetic yogurt and fat free milk is all forbidden. And absolutely forget ever eating watermelon, blueberries (OK, maybe you can eat a few a day) or banana.
Jag1 - The same advice could be given to you. Go find a book on endocrinology, and you will find the facts outlined there. Stop reading broscience and actually look at the science behind adiposity. I have looked extensively at the literature, (as I like to back up what I say before opening my mouth.) If you care to, read Good Calories Bad Calories and you will also see the references to the scientific literature that Gary Taubes used as a basis for his book.
Can you point me to any medical textbook that is talking about what you stated above? I would eat crow if the need called for it…
