How do doctors get paid

interesting perspective and analogy, and I think far too true-----

How do doctors get paid?

Imagine going to your favorite restaurant. You are greeted at the door by the hostess, who seats you and takes your drink order. You order through your favorite waiter, Andrew, who recommends the special of the day: prime rib with a dinner salad and a chocolate torte for dessert. Soon after, the food is brought out and it is delicious! You have time to enjoy your food. You then receive the bill and pay for your meal, returning to your home satisfied, all your dining needs met. Let’s say, for simplicity’s sake, you paid $75 for this meal: $50 for the steak, $10 for the salad and $15 for the dessert.

A change then occurs in the restaurant industry. A new form of eating out has been adopted. Your favorite restaurant has now contracted with over 30 different ”restaurant insurance companies.”

Anticipating another pleasant dining experience, your return to the restaurant with your new “subscribers card.” You pay your $5 “copay.” You sit in the foyer of the restaurant. You wait an hour, even though you made reservations. A harried Andrew greets you and quickly takes your order after you briefly glance at the menu. The food arrives at your table. As you take your second bite, Andrew informs you that “your time is up” and the table is reserved for another party. You are escorted outside with your hastily boxed left-overs.

What has happened to the restaurant? Behind the scenes, the restaurant owner has learned some tough realities of the “new system.” During the first month of taking insurance, the owner sends a form to the insurance company requesting payment for the $75 steak dinner: $50 for the steak, $10 for the salad and $15 for the torte. The contract with the insurance company already states that they will only pay $45 for the $50 steak, but the owner decides that the extra customers brought to the restaurant by contracting with this insurance company will more than off-set this small loss.

The first attempt at collecting the $75 dollars for the full meal is returned unpaid with the note that it was rejected due to a “coding error.” The forms for payment from the insurance company require the owner to list the parts of the meal, not by name, but by the numerical codes. The owner had listed the salad by the wrong numerical code. No suggestions for the correct code are offered, so the restaurant owner purchases a series of books, at a cost of $500, to learn how to assign the correct code to the different parts of the meals. These books will need to be bought annually due to the constant changing of the code numbers. After 30 minutes of study, the owner realizes the dinner salad should be coded as a 723.13, not the723.1 the owner originally put on the form. The salad, it turns out, needed to have two digits after the decimal point, indicating that it was a dinner salad, and not a “main course” salad. The owner mails the corrected form.

In response to the second request for payment, the insurance company does not send a check, but a detailed questionnaire: Was garlic used in seasoning the steak? Was it necessary to use garlic for this particular recipe? Did the restaurant ask for permission to use garlic from the insurance company before serving the steak? Why was salt, a less expensive alternative, not used instead? The owner submits the answers, emphasizing that the garlic is part of a secret family recipe that made the restaurant famous.

The owner waits another week (it has now been 3 weeks since the dinner was served). The check arrives three and a half weeks after the meal was served. The check is for $20 and states that it is specifically for the steak. The check also comes with a letter stating that no billing of the patron may occur for the salad, but no other explanation is enclosed. No mention is made of the $15 dessert.

The now frustrated restaurant owner calls the provider service number listed in the contract. After five separate phone calls to five different numbers (The harried voice behind phone call number four explains that the insurance company has merged with another insurance company and the phone numbers had all changed last week, sorry for the inconvenience…), the owner gets to ask why, when the contract says the steak will be paid at $45, has the check only been written for $20? And what happened to the payment for the $10 salad and the $15 dessert?

As it turns out, this particular patron’s insurance contract only pays $45 when the patron has reached their deductible, which this patron has not at this time. The remaining portion of payment for the steak must now be billed by the restaurant to the patron directly.

The $10 for the salad would have been paid if the patron had ordered it on a different day, but, per page 35 in the contract, because it was billed on the same day as the steak, it is considered to be part of the payment for the steak and no extra money can be collected from the patron or the insurance company.

The dessert, the owner learns, should have had a “modifier” number put with its particular billing code when billed with the steak and the salad.

Realizing that the insurance billing is quite a bit harder than anticipated, the restaurant owner hires a company, who is paid 5% of any money collected to specifically make sure these coding errors do not occur again and follow up on payment rejections. For an additional $99 per month, the billing company will “scrub” the forms submitted for payment to make sure specific clerical errors will not cause future delays in payment.

The owner now must lay off the hostess and the bus boy to pay the billing company, so these duties are now added to the waiter’s other responsibilities.

In the meantime, the restaurant owner has also had the waiter take on the job of answering the phones due to the now high volume of phone calls from patrons questioning why they are receiving bills for meals they ate over two months ago, and why did their insurance company not pay for this portion of the meal? This extra work is now resulting in longer times patrons must wait to be seated, and grumblings from the waiters who “were not hired or trained to do this kind of work.”

The owner now realizes that, although the dinner originally cost $75 to make, only $25 has been paid. The remaining $30 billed to the patron is now in its third mailing, with the first two requests for payment going unanswered by the patron. The restaurant owner realizes a collection agency must be employed in order to have any hope of receiving any portion of payment from the patron.

Each meal served now costs at least an additional $20 due to the added overhead of the billing company, coding books, and the collection agency. These added expenses have nothing to do with cooking food or providing any direct service to the restaurant’s customers.

Service to the restaurant’s patrons has been compromised with these changes as well. The owner has now over-extended the waiter, who was an excellent waiter, but is now taking on the roles of host, phone answering and table bussing.

In order to even meet the costs of providing fine dining, the restaurant owner now must seat twice as many patrons in the same amount of time.

What was once an outstanding business that focused on fine dining and customer service has now been turned into a business in the business of trying to get paid.

Alas, I wish this were a fictional tale, but it is not. The only fictional portion is that this is not your favorite restaurant, but your favorite doctor’s office, which is responsible not for meeting your dining needs, but those of your health.

Megan Lewis, M.D.

A family physician in rural Colorado.

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This is a great article, the only thing I would not is that the restaurant would start publishing prices and billing the insurance company $7,500 in order to collude with the insurance company to make sure that the going rate for a steak dinner was so expensive you had to buy insurance and you could no longer walk up and pay cash.

This piece was originally written by Megan Lewis and posted in February of 2009. When content from other places (which may be copyrighted) is posted would encourage everyone to make they are doing it properly under Fair Use. I think it is always good to post “part” of the original content rather than the entire thing and to link back to the original if at all possible.

Wow…great analogy!!!

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Brian, you are so very wrong! No “collusion” is occurring. Any and all profit goes to health insurance companies, not physicians!

Believe me, there are much easier ways to make money in this world. Knowing what I know now after 24 years of practicing medicine, I might have chosen another career had I not wanted to help patients as much as I do… Getting (under)paid for under 50% of the actual time I work, being on call, not being able to leave each day until all work is done, having to fight insurance companies for every penny I make, not being able to prescribe the meds my patients need because their insurance won’t cover them… The reality is what is described by Dr. Lewis above, and not what you’ve written, Brian.

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ETA: Dr. Lewis is incorrect about one thing: going rate for billing services is much higher. I pay my billing service 7.5%, and they work almost as hard as I do to get nowhere close to a fair fee for services rendered.

Agree with @rgcainmd. The practioners aren’t getting all the money. I don’t think the insurance companies are raking in the profits as much as the hospitals though. $50 for a very small container of sterile water. $11 for a single potassium tablet. $167 for a fingerstick A1c in office when LabCorp charges $30.

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I have to disagree. My physicians (and other medical service providers) routinely bill “rack rate” fees that are higher than double the insurance paid rates and in some cases I have found billed rates as high as 100 times the insurance reimbursement rates. I agree that physicians are not necessarily profiting from this (although I have found some who are) and it isn’t clear that physicians even have the power to change things. But by participating, physicians and health care institutions have to take responsibility at some level for this perversion of the market for healthcare.

It is an almost perfect circle of blame that can be used by colluding participants (Note: there are good, bad and ugly in all three groups). Doctors can point to the hospitals, they in turn point at the insurance co’s and they point back at doctors. As I stated, not all are part of this collusion but there is no doubt that there is some (more than enough) that the system is where it is, Pretty Broken…
All in name of the mighty $$…
We the consumer suffer the most along with the unwilling participant doctors, insurance reps and hospitals that try to be on the up and up.

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The whole conversation is silly… I think doctors are extraordinarily overworked and underpaid for what they do. At the end of the day, I earn a higher salary driving boats for a living than the average primary care physician in the USA-- yet we want to pretend that they’re somehow perpetuating some sort of scam of which we the patients are the only victim? Believe be when I say that the system victimizes doctors just as much as patients. By the “system” I’m referring both to insurance and pharmaceutical industries and also the government.

Yes medical care is absurdly expensive but the doctors aren’t the ones laughing all the way to the bank…

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I forgot to put the Pharma co’s in my Circle and I agree out of the four groups doctors are at the mercy of the other three.

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I don’t know where you live or how your physicians bill for their services or how they get paid, but every single physician I have spoken with about this particular matter (a total closing in on triple digits) is struggling to survive in the system described so eloquently by Dr. Lewis. No physician I know can simply jack up their rates by some ridiculous percentage and “collude” with health insurance companies. Health insurance companies would outright laugh in my face if I tried to do this, and would turn me in to my state’s medical licensing board. This is illegal, the physician would be caught in short order, would lose her/his license to practice medicine, would be required to pay astronomical fines, and would face legal prosecution and possible prison time.

You’re correct about physicians not having the power to change things, however. Attempting to do so would be a more-than full-time job in and of itself. We already are not allowed enough time with our patients due to the excessive amounts of documentation which are required in order to get paid for even a fraction of the hours we work, not to mention the time we routinely spend justifying the services we need to provide for our patients to their health insurers so they will pay for these services, arguing with insurers to cover needed services, and downright begging for coverage of these services when the second, third, or fourth denial comes around.

Brian, how exactly do you suggest I “take responsibility at some level for this perversion of the market for healthcare”? And when am I supposed to do this when I am already working 50 to 70 hours per week just to meet my overhead costs and take home a not-so-decent paycheck to support my child?

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Most of my doctors are quite wealthy comparitively to me and make a very good living living in wealthy areas, one has received over 200,000 to date from pharma companies.

That’s a tremendous amount when converted to keychains, pocket calendars, ink-pens etc since that’s the only sort of t thing pharma companies are allowed to give physicians (things of essentially zero value)…

@rgcainmd how many hundreds of thousands of dollars have you gotten from big pharma over your career? :wink:

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Physicians such as the one to which you refer are few and far between and are called “Drug Company Whores” by the rest of us. I don’t even consider them worthy of the title “Dr.”

In answer to your question, Sam, I have gotten a grand total of $0.00 from Pharmaceutical Companies. I have, however, received my fair share of post-it notes, pens, and scotch tape dispensers (woo hoo!) when this was still allowed. For the past 5 years or so, reps cannot give us so much as a free cup of coffee when they come calling. I have to buy my own caffeine and pens now, poor me!

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Nice try Sam, but it’s not from keychains… what a joke… it was for consulting and speeches… fake speeches which was a scandal exposed in a newspaper… unfortunately this is not illegal, but obviously it is highly unethical… just look your doctors up at dollars for docs if you want to know if they have received money from pharma companies. I should include that although it is not apparently illegal… a pharma rep was the one who blew the whistle on that scandal, no charges were pressed in that case, I believe there have been cases where charges have been pressed when pain killer rx were involved which is one of the only thing this country appears to care about.

Another of my recent referrals had received over 30,000. You can see which company and drugs they are receiving money for. Most of the others had received only small amounts so from this aspect there were ok. A former doc and friend of mine said she regularly was paid to go to conferences by pharma companies and she thought this was ok- it wasn’t illegal… but it’s not ethical and it’s a clear conflict of interest at the least.

I could get $200,000 for giving fake speeches if I was a doctor? Gee I should go to medical school!

It’s really surprising that there is a tremendous doctor shortage and it takes weeks or months to get an appointment if they’re all cutting such fat hogs in the a$$ you’d think there would be a huge surplus of them

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Sam, I guess I missed the “How to Give a Fake Speech and Make $200 K” class in med school. And I guess my highly-ranked Internship and Residency Program didn’t offer a course in this area. Dammit!!!

Seriously, I’ve been approached more than once by pharmaceutical companies with offers of high pay for promoting their meds at presentations. My moral thermostat is set too high to accept such offers. And 95% of the physicians I know play by the same rules.

Throughout my medical education, I was taught that physicians are held to a higher standard. But at the end of the day we are all human. It should not surprise anyone that a percentage of our ranks, like the ranks of every profession, are unethical and dishonest asshats.

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That’s too bad, you could have paid off med school in an hour (joking of course). I wouldn’t really even see what the ethical dilemma is actually if a drug company wanted to hire an expert to speak about their product… As long as they’re telling the truth to the best of their ability and not prescribing the product inappropriately or urging others to, what’s the problem?

If voith-Schneider or Rolls-Royce propulsion systems came to me and offered me money to speak to a class of operators to educate them on advanced techniques and applications for their products, would it be unethical for me to accept their offer? I really don’t see why? Or what the difference would be. Perhaps I could give a fake speech.

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You’re right, Sam, I would have absolutely no qualms about giving a presentation about the benefits of a medication that I had routinely prescribed for an extended period of time, had found beneficial in treating my patients’ symptoms without causing untoward side effects, and had sound scientific studies backing up the pharmaceutical company’s claims (we’re talking multiple randomized controlled trials). Unfortunately these kinds of medications don’t need physician speakers to promote them. After that much time has elapsed, everyone else has likely come to the same conclusion and they no longer need a Drug Company Whore to tell them that this medication is decidedly nifty. With rare exceptions, only the relatively new-on-the-market medications (which may look fine and dandy in clinical/research trials but may actually end up not being all they’re cracked up to be during more extended use in real-life patient populations) need physicians to promote them in this manner. Some of these medications turn out to be the next best thing to sliced bread, but I personally won’t know this until quite some time after their release, at which time my speech-giving talents are no longer being requested.

None of my docs or their offices even allow “reps” to come in to their offices. They don’t offer drug samples or give meds in the office. If a prescription is necessary it is written or called in to the pharmacy and they write if substitution is allowed or not and then Insurance and Pharmacy determine what is handed over. The only provider in my crew that might be considered “wealthy” would be the dentist, and she is only paid what insurance allows and it’s not even close to the charges. Her “wealth” is earned in my opinion and is subsidized by her amazing artist of a husband.

Doctors get a lot smack talk around here and elsewhere, and it is kind of sad. Not only do they not even take very good care of our sad selves, they charge too much, and they are drug whores! How about going about getting what you need to manage your diabetes without your doctor. Give it a shot…seems they don’t do much for most of ya, and the cost is not worth it.

As usual, my feelings toward my docs and even the pharmacy include appreciation, respect, and even gratitude for caring for me and giving me the best possible options with whatever limitations exist in my conditions(s) as well as my bank, and my coverage. But then I’ve got an awesome crew.

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