Anyone go Low Carb in Honeymoon?

How old a teen is your son? I'm not against carb reduction for grown adults. A teen girl of 16 is full grown. But I believe boys do not reach adult growth until much later, possibly in their early twenties, late teens. Carb reduction to prolong the honeymoon might be okay. You will need to find an endo and nutritionist to guide you in this approach. I suspect it will be very hard to find a pediatric endocrinologist who will agree with this. Children need carbs to grow; if athletic, your son will have to fuel his body with carbs once he is on insulin. Exercise causes the blood sugar to drop. Just walking an extra mile a day will cause our DD's basals to drop ten to fifteen percent. You can use less insulin if you exercise; but exercise is a double-edged sword, can cause lows after or overnight. I personally disagree with extreme carb reduction and favor a more balanced approach. Our endo told us at least 120 grams a day for our 100 pound teen; that the brain needs that much glucose and her body needs that much in general. There are days she will eat less and days more. I would try to point your son toward eating a healthy diet, with the appropriate amount of whole, natural, low-glycemic foods. Nothing drastic. Your endo most likely had you speak to a nutritionist who probably fashioned a diet for your child. I might modify it to suit your child's eating pattern, but I would stick to at least the minimum carb allowance advised. On the days our teen just does not feel like eating much and therefore the carbs are 50 grams instead of 120 or 150 or even more, I have had to lower basals extensively plus give her juice overnight constantly because her blood sugar then drops. Consequently, she has eaten extra grams, all fast sugar. Just try to eliminate the junk and give healthy carbs. I'm all for prolonging the honeymoon though, so if you can go low carb and give him more time off insulin, it probably won't effect his health adversely since it will not be for too long a time.

I've just never seen any evidence that we needs carbs to grow. This seems to be just made up stuff. What we do know is that elevated blood sugars impairs growth in children. It would be imprudent to accept high blood sugars and established risks of growth impairment to just keep someone "happy."

ps. And our brains are quite happy without dietary carbs, here is an example of a man who fasted for more than a year. If he really needed dietary carbs for his brain, he would have died.

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I am not sure that we do not need "carbs" to grow. I do believe that we do not need grains to grow. Other carbs are to be found in nuts, seeds, veggies and fruit. Nutrient density is important!

I really believe that diabetes is all about blood sugar stability and not cranking up the insulin. How one person gets there vs another may be different for each individual.

But I have the resistance of mainstream Pediatric Endocrinology.

One day at a time.

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My son is 15 and in honeymoon. He is on 1 unit of Lantus only. Based on that amount I have found the balancing carbohydrate amount of 30 to 40 carbs per meal. That is not carb restricting. My interest is to take the inflammatory grains out. That will certainly reduce his carb intake and he will be off insulin. It is all a balance.

The Endo we see does not have a dietician or nutritionist in their office. I am incorporating lots of information and education on how to take on this disease.

I called his office last week and Dr. Bernstein answered. He said that it was best to work with a supportive family doctor. He did not mention a supportive Endo list. I will contact the office again today. Thank you.

I think we need to push back at our doctors with these positions and ask them to "show me the evidence." We do have evidence that children can be placed on low carb diets for extended periods with no harm. For instance, here and here are studies on the safety and application of low carb diets in adolescents. The most compelling argument is that a ketogenic diet has been used for more than 80 years in the treatment of epilepsy and has not been found to have any long term effects. The diet is applied by places like Johns Hopkins a leader in pediatric epilepsy treatment.

Frankly, the whole idea of "nutrient density" to me is confusing. If you really want nutrient density, then meat and seafood should be at the core of your diet not "carbs."

I agree to the low carb approach. That is why I am here. What we fuel are body with has a lot to do with the response. So nutrient density and those found in fruit, veggies, nuts and seeds are important. And again the first and foremost foods normally taken out of any diseased body are dairy and grains. The Ketogenic Diet is a wonderful approach! Therefore relying on protein and fats. Where we get the proteins from has always been a hot topic and will continually be argued.

why do grains always get a bad rap; inflammatory? in what way, unless he has celiacs, there is nothing wrong with 'grains'. what you will find, as the honeymoon ends and his insulin needs increase, anything can spike blood sugars, many type 1's can balance a regular diet. however, many other things can spike us much higher then 'grains', bananas, fruits, yogurt, milk products, even a full plate of protein. insulin is what he needs and will need. lantus is long acting and has nothing to do with diet or what he eats. as i mentioned, the best way to protect beta cell function IS with insulin, not trying to withhold it. his body is influx right now. even though he's still able to process foods, etc...this will end. i almost wish I hadn't had a honeymoon, it made it worse for me.

Endos suggest eating carbs so we take the insulin, which the fast acting were designed to work with (CARBS) so we can reserve that beta cell function. An endo, IMO, is whom you should be working with, partnering with not Dr. Bernstein for pete's sake. Why make your child suffer through this, He has type 1 diabetes, it's going to be full on soon, it may change rapidly or gradually, but does it really matter, if so..to whom?

Without getting too detailed and into a discussion of what you or I or anyone feels is best. I do have one statement. Decreasing carbohydrate intake (what ever carbs you wish to choose) will decrease the amount of insulin needed. Now or in the long haul.

Remember that Diabetes is everyone's own journey. That is why there are different types of support groups and interest groups within this website.

Opinions best be left out. This is a place for support and information.

Thank you.

we need what we need for insulin. lowering carbs won't decrease basal insulin. the way to preserve beta cell function and try to help regulate an already suffering and attacked pancreas is WITH insulin. everything based on here is indeed our own journey chalked full of experiences and opinions. providing one's opinion does not take away supporting other members.

You asked for experiences in low carbing during honeymoon, i provided mine. I wish I hadn't extended my honeymoon. After DKA, for whatever reason, I did have a honeymoon, i went down to only 2 units basal...and eating only around 30 carbs/day, my body could still handle that amount. But, the beast was just lurking it's nasty head around the corner, soon it was 6 units, 10, 12 of basal and became very difficult to eat anything. I've also made myself so sensitive to carbs. I wish I had followed a different approach during my honeymoon, but...can't go back. I would read on here all the stories of type 1's thinking, "OH, thank god I don't have it like that, I don't have it bad." but, it came on hard and strong..full blown type 1, just like everyone else. There is no way to fight this, unfortunately. best of luck.

I went low carb(<100/day) about 6 months after dx when I was still honeymooning. ditched all grains, processed food, dairy(except cheese), most fruit, pretty much anything that comes in a package. Basically what Bernstein recommends, but w/ more carbs from vegetables. This drastically reduced my insulin even though I never went off it completely like some claim they do, and after 2 yrs I believe I still am honeymooning thanks to the tight control my diet has allowed me to achieve. My insulin requirements, however, have gradually increased over the last 18 months, which leads me to believe my beta cells may still be slowy dying off in spite of my diet and tight control.
Most endos should be supportive of the idea if its producing good results. mine initially said eat whatever I want just give myself enough insulin(lol!), but after seeing my results on my diet now she says I shouldn't change anything. my office visits are usually very short!
good luck with your son..i cant imagine trying to get a teenager to understand the importance of this all, especially when his friends are eating whatever they want!

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I agree. I don't think there's a necessity for carbs. Here, we rely on vegetables & minor amounts of selected fruits for our carbs. Grains & dairy are very, very limited.

My concern would be restricting insulin during a period of rapid growth. You cannot compare the nutrition needs of a growing teen to an adult. They're not even close.

Keeping someone happy, especially a newly dx'd T1 teen, is a fairly important priority, considering the risks. There are plenty of CWDs not eating any special diet & maintaining consistent A1Cs <7, so it's not an either/or situation. You can find quite a few of them on childrenwithdiabetes.com.

+1

we get all the carbs we need from veggies/fruit/nuts. Grains are unnecessary at best, and flat out dangerous at worst, and there are plenty of studies on gluten intolerance that prove this. and, regardless of the individual, every grain out there will spike bg.
Having experienced both low carb and high carb diets, I would never consider going back to high carb, even if I was cured of my diabetes tomorrow!

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Thank you for your response. My efforts are to replace with what he will loose out on. That is primarily bread! And there are plenty of recipes out there now using almond and coconut based ingredients. Missing out on the quick grab foods and McDonalds with the boys will be another thing.

I have told him that he has been given an Adult disease. This is one area of his life that he needs to treat it as such. One day at a time. The idea is not restriction but addition!

It will be hard to know what the outcome will be. Every day, month and year will be different.

At least I have the opportunity to give him a base that he can return to one day.

Thank you.

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Carbohydrates, well particularly monosaccharides from simple carbs are the primary fuel source for the metabolism. Calories are the count really for everything as it's an energy value, and as it's energy and thereby pretty much paramount to everything under the fundamental laws of physics and the universe. Protein can't accurately be used as it includes a variable of amino acids which can't be used as fuel. Which only leaves fat or carbohydrate which gives a direct output level for fuel for the body allowing it to function, 9 calories per g of fat, or 4 calories per g of carbohydrate. And lets face it, a fat based diet isn't going to be healthy living, thereby we use carbohydrate which gives us a varied diet and one that can be used to do balancing off.

As for trying to use low carb in honeymoon to try and protect the beta cells it's not going to happen. He's T1, sticking your head in the sand may make you feel better but it's not going away. I've seen far to many parents of T1's force the poor kid to not do this, not do that, can't eat this and all it ends up with is a ticked off kid (myself included back in the day) rebelling. And torturing the poor kid by avoiding the foods he may like is not going to aid anyone either. Having a healthy diet is fine, but if he wan't to go out for a burger or pizza with his friends, then so be it.

We are T1's, we can eat and do anything we like. It's all a matter of energy input from food, and conversion of this to calories with balancing that off energy output and insulin needed to metabolis it.

Sorry but he'll never be off insulin until/if they find a cure. He's T1.

Read up on the Ketogenic diet. The world is a changing!

No one is forcing. There is education involved. If today he is comfortable on taking off a bun on a hamburger or asking for whole grain, I do not think that that is forcing. He will know what he can have as his body reacts to it.

Not feeling well and having abundant highs and lows is less gratifying than BG stability.

It's about teaching a teen about healthy choices, just as we make choices of whether to smoke or take drugs or what to put in our diets and lifestyle choices.

Thank you.

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And don't say sorry, because I have connected with plenty that have. It happens for some and not for all.

That's like saying there is no cure for cancer! And by god! Many have!

Keep the positive energy coming!

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shawn, cant agree with you more about not going back to a high carb diet. i think if i were cured tomorrow, i would certainly induldge, but as i do now, at parties, dinners out, etc. i feel so much better! i dont know how much of that is being on insulin and how much is eating low carb, but big difference! weird.

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Insulin is also inflammatory as are many carbohydrates (those glorious over adulterated grains) as well as processed foods. The key is to create an environment that is as close to the bodies normal. The body is always in a state to heal. Pumps and insulin bring us closer to that reality. But adding in a ratio of carbs to proteins to fats that works well for each of us is the next challenge. Listening to the body is key. Why taxi the body with one more foreign substance. Eat as close to nature as nature intended, get off the crap and you will know it. You don't have to argue it or question it. Everyone will feel a difference, whether Type 1 or not!