Competition in the CGM Market


#1

Reinstated previously posted article later deleted.


#2

Dismisses Medtronic as a viable stand alone competitor. Let’s be clear this is the opinion of the CEO of Dexcom. One might say the statements are self serving to ay the least. But in addition it is especially important to note that the spokesperson is speaking of the stand alone systems, a market that Medtronic only entered in the last quarter.

Note: I am a Medtronic ambassador. My opinions are my own. They did not pay me to say nice things about Medtronic devices or the company. OK, they sent me a shirt and a cup but even I am more expensive than that.


Deleted
#3

Whats interesting about this Kevin Fu presentation is that it is his opinion that patients have no recourse when medical devices fail. You are really putting a lot of faith in a company when you use their device. Patient and device manufacturers must have a relationship built on trust. Medtronic has been eroding trust for years. I think you see the backlash in the diabetic community more than any other patient community, simply because we, as a group, have more life experience with medical devices, long term, than any other group. Min 55

I think the safety and effectiveness of their devices is definitely in question.
P.S. Nothing personal, RPhil2. I’m glad you feel like its working for you. I know this stuff is contentious. We are like fans of opposing sports teams, lol.


#4

Not entirely accurate. Medtronic was in the cgm stand-alone field previously and withdrew.

This is their attempt to come back and convince people that this time is better than last time.

I do not believe this is solely the opinion of the Dexcom CEO.

As always, time will tell.


#5

Medtronic has been in biz since 1949, apparently. Medtronic has time on their side, in that, it is conceivable that they might some day have a working product. Time is not on the side of diabetics who may be using an insulin pump without a functioning CGM. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JftRPRSJ5LM

I have my doubts about pump functioning, in addition. Just to put all biases out there. But, I dont know how many responses to this study there have been. Ive always been interested., if anybody has found any.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2825629/


#6

Regardless of who may or may not think it - this artilicle is about the opinion of the head fo Dexcom. I think most agree that Medtronic has a week position in the stand alone cgm market, even their repesenative did not suggest they have a large market share. I think Medtronic could say Dexcom has a weak potion in the Dexcom branded delivery system. Especially since thy do not have a dexcom branded device.

My point in responding is that this article says nothing about the quality of Medtronic CGM;s - it speaks only to the market position of their separate CGM product and is solely the opinion of its competitor.

And with that I will now retire from a discussion of opinions by competitors.

Note: I am a Medtronic ambassador. My opinions are my own. They did not pay me to say nice things about Medtronic devices or the company. OK, they sent me a shirt and a cup but even I am more expensive than that.


#7

@Rphil2

That is disappointing.

I never took you as somebody like this.

:frowning:


#8

Hm. I can sympathize with him. I don’t think there’s anything insincere or ill-motivated about @Rphil2’s attempts to help people here who have difficulties with Medtronic CGMs, particularly in respect to the 670G, which can certainly be a thankless task at times. I also respect him for adding some alternate perspective to this thread, which launches on a pretty tendentious note right from the title, and I think his comments about what the linked article is—and isn’t—about are well taken. I can’t blame him for not wanting to stick around and get beat on.

For my part, I’ve used both systems simultaneously and I found them about neck and neck accuracy-wise. I had a problem with the Guardians undershooting my BG in the a.m., which was a problem for using automode, but I have pretty much the same issue with Dexcom G5 in the a.m., so for me that’s a wash. I find Dexcoms easier to insert and keep on for two or more sensor sessions, and I like having the iPhone and other apps to echo my results on other platforms via Share, so that’s why I went back to 'em. But whichever people prefer, I think it’s a positive development that MdT is marketing a stand-alone now, as I think the competition is healthy, and the lack thereof not so much.


#9

Guys. I used and liked the G5. I used it for 3 years found it accurate and I loved it.

I like the Medtronic pump- sensor combo better. As for leaving the conversation all I meant was there is no reason for me to repeat myself time and again. Thus I intended to depart the conversation because I have no more to say about it.

Unless of course my motivation is questioned. I have other stuff to be concerned about other than the status of a quarterly businesss report.

Now I hope I can leave you in peace. I certainly am not angry. Carry on but unless I get brought back in I have no more to say about this. Besides I am tired of using the disclaimer on this.

Note: I am a Medtronic ambassador. My opinions are my own. They did not pay me to say nice things about Medtronic devices or the company. OK, they sent me a shirt and a cup but even I am more expensive than that.


#10

I think if medtronic wants a stand alone cgm to succeed, they are going to have to improve their sensors AND find a bunch of new diabetics. Almost 4 years ago, I started trying to use the enlite sensors. I was excited, even though I only wanted a pump at the time, because the medtronic representative made such bold claims about what it could do (I thought if it does 50 % of what she claims, it will be a miracle). It was an unmitigated disaster. I never got a reading within 50 points of my meter, so it was useless, but also disruptive. I’ve been a diabetic long enough to know not all technology works for all people, so I was not surprised by this. What I was surprised by was medtronic response. I called them over a dozen times, over a 2 1/2 year period, always with a different representative, and every single representative tried to find a way to blame user error. The first 3 or 4 times, I accepted that because it was a new technology for me. The last phone call was me telling them to cancel all future orders, and to stop charging me, and they still wanted to have a conversation about how many times I was calibrating. They never offered to change the transmitter, or do anything to help. My pump is out of warranty in April, and if they had treated me with an iota of respect, I would get another medtronic because my pump has served me well. But their handling of the cgm side of things has made me decide to switch to any other pump manufacturer because I cant trust that if there is a problem they will help.

This was a long rant. I apologize.


#11

Becky, please don’t feel as if you have to apologize for telling it like it is! I spent so many hours myself with tech support that I can’t imagine it could be less than 100 hours, trying to find a solution to the myriad, continued problems with Enlite (and also, for 1 month, the Sof Sensors) for about a year. It was INFURIATING how the inaccuracies would wake me up with false readings, go higher (falsely) when I’d move around, go down when I’d sit or lie. I had 3 or 4 accurate sensors during that year and 2 of them got loose before the 6 days were up. I couldn’t believe how when I’d finally get one that worked, it would be the one to fall off (no matter how much I followed every taping method they could offer). I even had a rep out to the house to try to find solutions–all to no avail. So, no need to apologize, and I also won’t apologize for telling it like it is.


#13

This is the battle between Medtronic and Omnipod. I leave to you, to decide, which is which character. I can’t, personally, decide. Either way its funny scene and I think its a good reflection of how this conversation always goes. (I think my previous post was funnier and made more fun of all of us, but I have been sanctioned…again. Woe is me. )


#14

With only one exception over the past 7 years, can I say a Medtronic rep treated me improperly. I sometimes get annoyed with the amount of questions I am asked regarding the circumstances leading up to my problem, but I take it as a means to rule out personal error before geting down to the technical issues. I find them very thorough ((probably following a pre set procedure) in eliminating other possibilities before getting down to the actual cause of the problem. Once they get to the nuts and bolts, they patiently work with me until we agree on the appropriate resolution (usually replacing the sensor or infusion set.)

My sensors (Enlite, Guardian, and their predecessor?) were, for the most part, relatively accurate as long as I didn’t experience high spikes.


#15

I’ve had two Medtronic pumps, never had CGM with them. However a friend with 670G with the Guardian CGM switched to a Dexcom G6 in November and is thrilled. I’ll ask him to weigh in why here on his own.


#16

Just trolling here. I read the article on Adam Brown’s blog/website. I am so glad (mad?) that I am not the only one with the undershooting am bs!!! I have been unsuccessful in trying to stay in AM for the last 5 months or so. The guardian is SPOT ON every single minute every day until I put it in AM and my biggest complaint is that I wake up at my target bs according to the pump but then when I do a finger stick I’m much higher!!! Like 50-60 pts. which of course means then you can’t calibrate. I have had the 670 g less than a year (started in April 18) and I never use AM. I can’t. I can’t say that my own personal control is great or anything, but I can’t handle AM. I do appreciate the threshold suspend and use that quite a bit.

As for what the Dexcom guy said I mean it’s a business. There’s competition. Companies are going to talk smack about each other. Who knows what the CGM future holds for Medtronic. I think they released their closed-loop system way to early without all the bugs worked out and now they have a lot of dissatisfied customers. If they had just waited and worked on the technology and touted the benefits of the threshold suspend maybe they’d be in a better place? But really, are they in a bad place? I’m interested to see what else everyone offers and how well they do it. The proof is in the pudding.


#17

@Dave44 in the same sense I would say that you are biased against Medtronic, possibly much more biased against than @Rphil2 is for it.


#18

ah, MAYBE I’m biased because I spent countless hours for a year or more, dealing with Medtronic Enlite issues, and the same issues and time wasted with their previous version, Sof Sensors. Both were often random-number generators. So if you want to say I’m very biased, you GO RIGHT AHEAD. Bias is sometimes created from EXPERIENCE stemwinder; rather than some mindless idea that something is good or bad. I don’t think you need to try to characterize MY bias as being more biased than someone else’s .


#19

This is good entertainment!


#20

It is good, isn’t it, @jmorgandeal?
I suppose its as good a time as any to release my, personal, bias. Wont be that surprising.
I believe that, while Medtronic may not have made a direct effort to kill me, personally, they certainly have a sustained pattern of not making any effort to NOT kill me…which is somehow just as unsettling. Its difficult not to take it personally at this point. Maybe one ‘almost killing’ is an accident. Not more than one. Thats hard to forgive - repeated ‘almost killings.’ I wonder how many like me have not survived. There are no records kept.

I find it an unsettling issue to even bring up. Its a tricky thing to try and communicate directly. I believe that I have had entire, in person, conversations with other diabetics about this, without anyone stating it directly. We sort of “dance around” making a statement like, “I believe Medtronic knowingly does harm to diabetic patients.” Maybe you all could help with communicating something like that. There will come a day when I may need to say it out loud to another person, even if its socially uncomfortable.


#21

Interesting article that brings back bad memories!

I worked in a lab where we designed micropumps for analytical chemistry and one of my colleagues chided me that my pump (animas) couldn’t be accurate because the flow would depend on where I wore my pump. I told he was full of s*** and that syringe pumps aren’t susceptible to siphoning. We put a $20 spot on it and tested the pump in our lab. I was eating crow when the Animas delivery varied by 11% between delvery at eye level and knee level. Around my abdomen it was spot on.

It’s not as sophisticated as the lab syringe pumps we used, so I’ll chalk it up to my colleagues insight. He waved this in my face for more than a year! I won’t share this article or I’ll never hear the end of it!