Plant based diet and less severe Covid symptons

I’m sure several will pick apart the study or who did the study. But I thought it very interesting and informative and that people should be made aware. I have been a vegan for over 36 years now so I was happy to read this. I was already a vegan before I got type 1 and I wasn’t going to change my diet as I have strong ethical reasons for staying a vegan. I have excellent control of my Bg levels.

Plant-based diets, pescatarian diets and COVID-19 severity: a population-based case–control study in six countries

I’m skeptical, but maybe they have less cardio complications???
Are you still pretty worried about Covid, Marie? What will have to happen before you feel safe? Are you waiting for the 70% vacc rate or will you still feel nervous?

My friends mom asked me and some others not to come by the house last week because she is still quite nervous. Her husband is medically vulnerable. We think that the longer covid is at play, the more her anxiety is increasing as a caretaker. You have any recommendations for that? We don’t want them to become too isolated, but I also don’t want to add to anxiety so I’m just going to give them 6 weeks and check back in to see if feelings have changed.

There’s a strange prevalence of new fears here, like people are afraid to go into the cities from some gun violence. That doesn’t bother me, but this is a bit disturbing…Body Parts Found In Northeast Minneapolis Prompt Homicide Investigation – WCCO | CBS Minnesota

I am skeptical of the findings of studies that report an association between factors. The usefulness of studies like this is to suggest a hypothesis that might be tested, nothing more.

My quick survey of the link provided showed people who self-selected into various eating patterns. It didn’t provide a definition, for example, as to what “low carb, high protein” means. There has been a long history in studies like this where low carb could mean 200 grams of carbs/day!

Plus, people can self-select into one of the eating categories where they like to think they reside but in fact don’t really land. Even though these are health professionals as subjects, they are still people who are subject to all the flaws of human nature.

The study relies on subjects filling out “food frequency questionnaires,” a notoriously flawed tactic. It depends on the memory of participants about what they’ve eaten for various periods in the past and suffers from recall bias. Time and again, it’s been shown that people are just not good at this exercise.

Again, I don’t think that any actionable conclusion may be drawn from an observational study like this but it could serve as a source to create a hypothesis to be tested.

If you don’t mind, would share these reasons? I’m asking because I never quite understood veganism. Vegetarianism I totally get, but I’ve never been able to comprehend what’s wrong with animal products which were ethically obtained without harming the animals… Like honey or dairy. Stressing the ethically, because I’ve got major issue myself with confined feeding operations.

@Terry4 While you can pick a category to fall into, you don’t have to. Such a huge difference decline in symptoms suggests the basics will hold true that there is a benefit to a plant based diet. I would have a strong assumption knowing the nutrients that are in fruits, veggies, grains and beans that it has a lot to do with a higher consumption of those foods.

@mohe0001 I have been vaccinated but I still am leery of covid and the variants, knowing a persons symptoms are usually less when vaccinated. There will be a certain caution I believe to going out and about “freely” while so many still get sick for some of us. I doubt I would get on a plane for a while, but I did go to a restaurant that had a very open outdoor setting where a group met. Some still die vaccinated although obviously a small percent and a majority but not all those hospitalized are non vaccinated people. So yes a lot of us older crowd or compromised people are not ready to jump in fully. I still believe in masks to help protect cancer patients, youth etc. Such a small thing really.

@Robyn_H I started out as a vegetarian at the age of 11. I had met cows in person and connected the cow with the hamburger on the plate and realized I didn’t have to eat it and cause it to be killed just because of a food choice on my plate. At that point I hadn’t even realized the tremendous suffering in the meat industry.

Fast forward to my early 20’s and reading about veal, calves kept caged and that 50% of dairy cows born are male and not wanted except for being raised as veal or meat and that drinking milk promoted those cows being born into those horrible conditions. Male baby chicks born are not egg layers and not wanted and are still thrown live into meat grinders because that is the cheapest and easiest way to deal with them.

Besides the fact of the atrocities at slaughter houses and the fear and pain and suffering animals go through, I do not want to be a cause for any animal to end up there.

I am all for “just” vegetarianism. My husband is just a vegetarian. But ethically a vegan is usually taking it a step further. While vegetarians are likely to become vegetarians because of 50% ethical and 50% health reasons, a lot of the health reasons to become one will still have some animal welfare cares with it. While a vegan is more likely to be a vegan for ethical reasons and then carry some health reasons into it. The popularity of being a vegan for health reasons is picking up rapidly.

But I know the animal behind that meat and that animal has emotions and feels pain. I do not want to be involved in any part or process of that fear and pain.

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Yup, it was veal that got me too. I was 7 and I heard what veal was and thought, “This is not for me.”

Soooo gross, Marie. I’m gonna try not to read the sordid details of meat. Ewe.

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I still walk at a distance from teenagers and kids - they make me most nervous, now. I’m not super convinced that masks help much, so if there’s concern, I just stay physically away. Covid is so random. There are young, healthy people I know who were hospitalized, but there were also VERY immunocompromised people I know who did fine with covid. Its sooo random and hard to predict.

Overall, people I know who went into the office everyday got covid (mask or no mask) and people who worked remote did not. That seems to be the most consistent variable that I saw play out. But, there were exceptions to both - one young woman who worked remotely with my brother passed away. There were older gentleman going into the bars with diagnosed covid infections who never got it. My friend with advance HIV got it and did just fine (no hospitalization). A young marathon runner who works with a friend was hospitalized. There are so many cases on both sides, I just consider it a roll of the dice.

Eventually, I’m gonna need to go into the office and I expect to get it when I do. We’ll see how long until I get it. :sneezing_face: I’ve been eating at restaurants, sometimes indoors, but I’ve always preferred to eat outdoors. I’ve been indoors shopping and am getting rid of instacart. I’ve been to outdoor events with the general public (carnivals and car shows). I’ve been to museums. So far, so good. I would just not spend too much time near any one person in particular if your nervous. Like, don’t breath too much of any one person’s exhaled air. That should help.

@mohe0001
I have been thinking about your comment about masks not necessarily helping much and have to strongly disagree.

We all know that virus load seems to be a factor in getting sick, it’s also one reason vaccinated people aren’t as likely to pass it on, they have a low virus load when they do get it. Wearing a mask helps cut down on virus load in the air from a person as the mask helps prevent it being blown as far or in a higher concentration. It also helps stop a person wearing a mask from inhaling a larger virus count.

We have prevented having a huge issue here and have been pretty strict about mask wearing. People speak up here if you’re not. We also had a double test required for travelers for some time which helped prevent it from being brought here. Now the rules are more laxed and we have a high vaccination rate, but we still hardly any cases and we still have a strong mask rule. . We have groups that help police it. A majority of our cases are travelers or in contact with travelers, with a few linked to social gatherings where people weren’t masked. And yes at a few offices they have had a few cases break out, but only a few.

Our population doubles with tourists, and some bring it, and don’t really care because they are on vacay and then leave. But so far it’s not spreading rampant community wise, even in the non vaccinated. But one thing that has been consistent, wear a mask when you are out and about.

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Maybe I’m overly cautious. But, I’m from a background where you use an N-95 or better. I am yee of little faith that a cotton mask does much of anything. I would never want to walk into a facility with known tuberculosis cases with one of those ridiculous cotton cloth masks. I guess I kinda imagine covid exposure like TB.

Let me ask you this - how do you feel about public pools at this point?
I’m really struggling to find things that help get me physically back into shape and test what I can and cannot do. I’m REALLY out of shape.

I got Tidepool back up and running yesterday and I looked at my data from where I drove 1 1/2 hours for a job interview in 101 degrees in a wool suit (it was like being in a sauna). I was full blown medical emergency during that entire job interview. I need to get out and practice doing things and just see how it goes before I make a commitment to a job. I lack physical confidence right now. You need to have physical confidence in the city right now. You can’t be drunk or look messed up (from low BG) on the street because you’ll get ‘rolled.’

A public pool seems like a good test ground for doing something really physical because there are lifeguards around if anything goes wrong. It wont be that busy during work hours. But, there are a high proportion of kids. Its outdoors, which is good. The chlorine might help sanitize. But, it makes me a little uncomfortable. The lady at the gas station took all her grandkids to Wisconsin Dells and none of them have been vacc-ed. She’s a T2, so maybe its OK. What are your thoughts on the risks of public pools?

I just don’t know…

@mohe0001 Outside is safer but I would weigh how crowded the pool is. I personally would not want to be neck to neck with unvaccinated kids and people.
Gym pools aren’t usually as crowded, but is it indoors or outdoors or even open. Some areas are having surges, some are not.

This really comes down to what you want and think.

Regarding masks. I get the N95 masks, obviously much more thorough. But imagine a sneeze behind a cloth mask, how could a virus in mass amounts travel the 80 feet they know a virus can travel? Distance decreases viral load, and barriers reduce viral load. It was scary at one point as they showed someone sneezing in a grocery store and how some of the virus even landed in the next aisle. Anything that cuts down on viral load entering the body helps.

That’s a good point. I hadn’t thought of that.
Maybe if I go early in the morning. Kids are sooo social and wanna know what I am reading and want some of my cookies.

Sure, I get the sneezing thing. Your right. I also don’t worry a ton if I am just passing a stranger in the grocery store anymore. I guess I’m imagining a situation where I’m sitting in close proximity to other people in an office for 8 hours. In that case, there is either air flow between you or not. Cotton masks allow air flow and your gonna get it. That’s why I think that I will get it eventually and I have just accepted it.

My brother is still limiting contact a lot, but he has a newborn. He’s worried about mutations coming. That’s always been my number 1 concern since the first day of covid. What are your thoughts on that? How long do you think we have until the vaccine is ineffective?

@mohe0001
50% of all new cases in Israel, which is having a surge, is in vaccinated people. But most are not getting severely sick. They believe it’s the new Delta variant that is causing the issue. They only had a couple of cases a day and have raised to over a hundred a day. That is still not close to the 10,000 a day they had gotten before vaccinations. But the Delta variant is much more contagious and now that so many are getting the Delta variant all over the world, it will mutate too.

Sorry, but just because people want it back to “normal” and want to act like it’s normal, doesn’t mean it is. Do I go to the grocery store, yes, we still require masks here which I’m happy about. So no I don’t worry about passing someone in the aisle either. Will I stand right next to someone, no, I move away. Will I distance at the checkout line, yes. So yes, I go to stores, but I am still careful. With a newborn I would worry too, the Brazilian strain is hitting a higher percentage of kids. It would not be worth the risks to me. A young child like that it has to be super scary.

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I feel like Delta has been tearing things up in Michigan for months…since before they released vaccine. But, they say its spreading exponentially now.

I feel like I see people around me and their health has deteriorated…especially the elderly. People are a lot less fit than before covid. I’m the most out of shape that I ever have been. I’m concerned about heart attacks. I FEEL a lot less healthy. But, I’m really struggling to find some kind of balance. Very little of the normal stuff I do has resumed.

Maybe I can find someone to go swimming with me at the lake nearby. There won’t be any people there, but that makes me concerned about dark water and drowning if I have a seizure. Lord knows that I have pulled other people outta the lake before. I won’t do it alone - that’s my rule.

OMG, this just in from a member of the House…WE WIN!!! No more stupid drivers licensing rules for us!!!

"XXXXX,

The omnibus transportation bill passed the House yesterday. It includes the provision deleting the state rule requiring insulin-dependent diabetics register your health status with DPS. The same bill passed the Senate unanimously today and will be signed into law by the Governor.

Thank you for your support and advocacy. It’s a nice win and was a long time coming."

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Marie,
I too am LFPB T1 50 years. I went vegan after diagnosis of heart disease from T!. I have since adopted the Non harming aspect of all sentient beings and trying to do my part for the global effort and hopes for the generations to follow. I have great BG control, and kept all the complications of the early years at bay. Thanks for sharing the article.

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This is exactly what the study concluded. It was a small study in terms of participants but participants were selected from a group that would be very high for regular & close exposure to COVID. It found correlations that were significant but acknowledged the need for further study.

"Our results suggest that a healthy diet rich in nutrient-dense foods may be considered for protection against severe COVID-19. Future studies with detailed macro- and micro-nutrient data are warranted to study associations between dietary intake and COVID-19 severity.

They did not consider it a small sample size,

“Our study has several strengths, including a large sample size, diverse HCWs from multiple countries, and careful adjustment of potential confounding factors. Further, we were able to capture the early phase of the global pandemic, before the detection of known SARS-CoV2 variants of concern, which could further complicate a multinational epidemiological analysis, by leveraging an existing network of HCWs. However, our finding should be interpreted within the context of the following limitations. First, we relied on participants’ self-report to define exposures and outcomes. As such, there is a possibility of recall bias. However, HCWs are unique in that they may be a source of high-quality data (eg, complete information, probably high accuracy of information).35 Second, the definition of certain dietary patterns (eg, plant-based diets, pescatarian diets, low carbohydrate, high protein diet) may vary by countries. Nevertheless, it is encouraging that the responses on the food frequency questionnaire reflected intake of food groups that are consistent with these dietary patterns.”