I couldn’t agree with you more, Zoe. I should have mentioned that therapy and/or medication are often needed. I just think getting support around our diabetes issues, from people who really know, is a good start. So many of us feel so alone with this disease. When I was first diagnosed, I was fortunate enough to find a therapist with Type 1 diabetes to help me with my grief and my adjustment and my fear.
Hey guys,
I have been thinking about it and I think you are right. If I am asleep when I die, I will miss out on the whole experience. Esp. if I am dreaming, I won’t know what is the “death experience” and what is my usual wacky dreams I have. 
Dying while asleep is probably the least painful way to die but yeah, I want to know what happens so if I want to experience it is best I be awake. Not that I will remember the experience to take it anywhere afterwards (as far as I know) but yeah, I am too curious about what happens and what does it feel like to miss out on it. Less hope less pain still.
Oh absolutely, Melitta! That’s great that you had a therapist with Type 1; maybe if he/she is still practicing locally you could share the name with our Women’s Group! If I’d been diagnosed when I was younger I definitely would have gone towards working with clients with Type 1.
Quiet sigh of understanding…
Long enough, I do not believe people who claim they have “never” considered the idea, at least in some manner. The difference between the idea, the concept of suicide and the ACT obviously being two very, very different creatures.
And the “trick” is not feeding the latter… or letting it grow. As an idea, a vague concept it goes up there with bulding a house in outerspace, becoming a world famous linguist, becoming a “professional” anything , and the occasional act of Japanese “Seppaku”, for “noble purposes” only.
But the act itself… no thanks, one lousy pin-prick, one jab at a time is quite sufficent, about a close as I care to come. Ours is the death of the 1,000,000 lancets… an ancient torture method, recently (sic unfortunately) rediscovered.
Stuart
Yes, Stu, a little bit at a time, little pokes every day, all day long for me :blood sugar tests they are t toruturous, just necessary, a bit cumbersome and laborious at times, but then so is flossing my teeth… I considered suicide as a way out of anguish many years ago when I was not comfortable with who I was and Whose I was…When I began to realize that I was truly here for a purpose outside myself, and that denying that purpose would harm me,as well as anyone else who could be helped by me. It also defeated the purpose that the Creator has for me…As depressed as I was, I did not want to live nor die in defeat.
Do I consider suicide noble and necessary for some? I believe not.
God bless,
Brunetta
Here’s something to consider vis a vis depression and suicidal ideation:
Sometimes the warrior’s way quite literally saves lives.
Sometimes what is needed isn’t a soft, warm, self-indulgent pillow but a bracing splash of ice-cold water to the face.
There’s a reason why I’ve survived 40 plus years of chronic (recurring) clinical depression, and it’s not just hugs and cuddles. It’s being gently but firmly directed to look things in the face, even (especially) things that seem too hard or too painful or too much trouble, even (especially) when I can barely stand up and lift one foot in front of the other, even (especially) when I want to sink into nothingness.
There’s a time and place for warm, soft comfort. There is also a time and place for being picked up and dropped – kicking and screaming – into a shocking shower if icy truth.
Think of it this way: would you tell a Type 1 child that didn’t want to be poked that it was OK if they don’t test or take their injections? No. You’d say, “I know that you don’t like it. I’m sorry it hurts. I know it sucks. You have to do it anyway, because that’s what it takes to live.”
Depression isn’t all that different. When there is this silky, self-indulgent, wheedling voice in your head saying, “Oh, it will be so much easier if I just end it all…” the correct response is “no”.
The correct resonse is “NO!!!”
Whatever gets you to “NO” is good. Very, very, very good.
I must agree but will add if the gentle approach doesn’t work some times a smack in the face is what is needed, sometimes you can’t start to rise up until you hit rock bottom.
Riiiiiiight. Well, I’m sure glad you’re not a Psychiatrist.
Nope not a Psychiatrist, in school for social work with a focus in drug and alcohol addiction and plan on going into work with at risk teens, have been a sponsor for a few recovery programs. I am not saying the gentle approach doesn’t work but sometimes you have to drop the gloves and force a person to look at what they truly have to lose
I was once picked up after being literally knocked down by some friends and was told I could stay on the path I was on and end up dead in the street with the other junkies or I could get myself clean and start living my life. Once I got clean I thanked them for the beat down my actually physical life was the only thing I had left at the time.
Tough love and scaring straight is not the only way but it is the only way that will work for some. Yes my experience is mostly dealing with addicts but I have never met an addict who wasn’t depressed.
This past week I was a a friends house when we told another friend she needed to get clean or we would make a call to CPS. The night before another local “mother” had let her 9 month old burn to death while the “mother” was passed out on pills. I love my friend and love her children, I was not going to let something like that happen to her children. Last night she checked into rehab now we have to just wait and see.
I agree in tough love as far as hospitalizing people to help them get what they need… But… it is a different thing when it comes to mental health problems. To try to “tough love” someone into feeling better when they have a major clinical depression episode is like trying to tough love someone with Alzeheimer’s into remembering things. Just because it seems like someone has a choice in how they feel doesn’t mean they have one. It is very disturbing to me to see people may assume everyone’s depression is mild enough to be bullied into feeling better. Things like choosing to abuse drugs, and choosing to not take one’s insulin are NOT the same as being mentally ill. Those people are not choosing to feel bad, and they are not choosing easy paths to get out of their problems. They are ill.
Thank you for your courage and honesty. I wish someone had done the same for my family when I was nine. it might have made all the difference in the world.
My brother (God rest his soul) was a spiritual warrior and Friend of Bill. I learned so much from him about the healing power of courage and honesty. He was a walking/talking example of, “The truth will set you free.”
Will agree on that but still feel anything can help like you said involuntary hospitalizing some one. But will disagree on the addiction not being a mental illness, both Depression and Drug Addiction are considered mental illness buy the AP,. most addicts are self medicating for other problems they no the addiction is wrong and hurting them and some people are hardwired to be addicts. I have been clean for over a decade but that voice in the back of my head still creeps in saying one more time wont hurt at least once a month if not at times a day, its why I had a hard time after DX of giving myself a shot in the arm. I suffer from Low end Depression and Anxiety but my lows are much better off drugs then when I was on.
Substance abuse is a mental illness. It’s not as simple as choosing not to use. If it were, people wouldn’t be suffering & destroying their lives. It may look from the outside that it’s a choice & “just say no” is the answer," but it’s far more complex & a constant struggle like any other chronic condition. Ask anyone who has been through this hell. Commonly said is “I’m a recovering __.” Not recovered. not cured.
Addiction is a mental illness. I actually took a class in it for my BS in Psych - Psychology of Addcition.
I will always be a junky but I am off the junk. Of course I am not even getting into positive transference
We’re learning so much about how the mind works. It’s fascinating.
Neurotransmitters, seratonin, dopamine, reward centers and natural opiates…
Much of it is still a mystery. My doctor told me that when we look back on today’s anti-depressants, they’ll look like shooting a fly with an elephant gun. Future therapies will be targeted to specific genetic tests and brain scans. Depression, addiction, these are not single diseases, they’re clusters of diseases with similar symptoms, kinda like diabetes – what are they up to now? Fifteen diferent gene mutations that can (singly or in combination) result in diabetes?
It’s fascinating and it makes me wish I could live for a hundred years to see what else they figure out.
I don’t believe it’s an either/or. Everyone responds to different approaches, which is why it’s a good idea if you are looking for a therapist to “shop around” until you find one that feels right for you. Yes, addiction is an illness and not “bad behavior” and one of the characteristics of addiction is that you lose the ability to make choices
. But addiction and mental illness call for very different treatment approaches. And the “old school” heavily confrontational/bordering on abuse type of treatment for addiction characteristic of organizations like Synanon is just that…old school. It works well for some people, devastatingly poorly for others, especially women. I’ve seen many women addicts, a great majority of whom have experienced lifelong abuse - physical, emotional and sexual, spend literally decades struggling with cycles of recovery and relapse because the heavily confrontational approach just exacerbated their self-loathing and guilt.
I agree that a degree of confrontation, and always honesty are an important part of the therapeutic process. But it is also possible to confront gently, even lovingly. I actually see wonderful examples of that kind of gentle confrontation here on TuD on a regular basis.
LOL – I don’t know if you liked the movie “Clean and Sober” but my favorite scene is when Keaton and his sponsor are eating ice cream at the diner.
As a diabetic with eating issues, I laughed my head off at that…tearing up at the same time.
I’ll be honest here, I have severe chronic depression, even before I was diagnosed with diabetes. I have thought of, planned for and even wrote letters about suicide. I am currently on anti depressants and that has helped. But there are times, when my pain inside and the pain from outside, and the “D” get so large, I think why bother. But I have learned that “why bother” means call for help. And that is exactly what I do. I will get on that phone and call my therp…like it or not…I call. My life isn’t about dying it’s about living, with diabetes, with depression…but sometimes I need to be reminded of that and he is a good man who will listen and then we talk.
I agree. Different people need a different approach tailored to their condition, personality, family history, abuse history, substance issues, etc.
I don’t believe in being abusive but some people swear that a harsh “boot camp” approach worked for them and quite literally saved their lives.
I do much better one-on-one with someone who is rational, clear and courageous enough to contront me when my thoughts and behaviors are harmful and not helpful.
I’ve been working with someone on trauma issues since I was assaulted a year ago and it’s been very helpful. She’s teaching me a technique they use with soldiers after trauma in war. It’s very helpful to be able to step back and LOOK at my thoughts and feelings with clear eyes and no B.S. Is the thought true? Is it helpful? Is it based on habit or fact? Is holding on to it keeping me stuck? How could I rephrase it in a way that would be more helpful? Etc. Etc. Etc. It’s been very healing to learn how to step back and honestly confront my habitual thoughts.