Delta Variant Game Changer

Even though I’m vaccinated, i am back to double masking when riding train or inside a grocery store. (As opposed to single masking which I’d been doing all along).

It remains to be seen how high and long the infection rate spike due to Delta variant is.

Looking at UK, which has vaccination rate similar to US at large, they had a huge spike from Delta but it was very short lived. The US has more regional variation in vaccination rate so Delta may hit parts of US more severely than others.

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Same game; same players.

I am back to canceling non needed appointments. We have always had a mask mandate indoors, I am happy we kept that here.

One area in Mass as much as 73% of the new cases were people that had been vaccinated and 79% were showing symptoms. That is part of the reason the CDC is asking people to start wearing a mask even if vaccinated under certain conditions… The stats out of Israel were 50% of the people getting sick were vaccinated.
Vaccination at least seems to still work from preventing you from getting seriously sick.

One thing of note is they just came out that the protection rate drops to 83% at 4 months after you have gotten vaccinated from Pfizer and I gather they are going to be presenting information at the beginning of August about a booster shot. The UK on the other hand delayed the second shot because they were trying to get more people vaccinated with one shot first. They think that is giving the UK population longer and a higher immunity. One of the problems seems to be the Delta variant carries a lot bigger virus load and replicates faster than the original strains.

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Also there is this, a leaked document that the CDC says people vaccinated are as contagious as a non vaccinated person.

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This is the actual internal presentation from the CDC. I agree that the delta variant is alarming for unvaccinated people.

However, vaccinated people are only contagious if a breakthrough infection occurs- which is much less likely if you’re vaccinated than unvaccinated. In addition the vaccines still offer >90% effectiveness against severe illness - per the linked presentation.

Since I am not immunocompromised and do not have children in my home, I am not planning to change my behavior. I wear a mask when in stores because it’s really just not a big deal. It protects people who are not able to access the protection vaccines offer. I’m still spending time with vaccinated friends unmasked and going out to eat at restaurants (mostly outdoors, but not always).

While I have no desire to be infected, the virus isn’t going anywhere. I plan to manage the risk based on CDC guidance and to enjoy my life while I’m alive.

The vaccines work. I’m sure we’ll get a booster eventually, and I plan to take it when it’s recommended.

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We’ve been reading about the delta variant for quite some time, so even before the recent announcements, we went back to mask-wearing in many public areas, and were still distancing. Even then, if nothing else it was for other people around us. The areas were we are going unmasked are dinner out when seated with family, time inside with people within our bubble, and for me, when I am at the gym, although there I usually maintain distance.

Although we live in Manhattan, in an area known for its post-college inhabitants, our condo building is a naturally-occurring retirement community (NORC). We have many older residents. I recently read how older vaccinated people have the same risk as the younger unvaccinated, meaning that a fully-vaccinated 85-year old has the same risk as an unvaccinated 50-year old.

So for seniors around us, as well as family members in the same age bracket, plus the people we can see in frail health, and the immunocompromised we can’t see, we have been donning masks for the past few weeks, and in fact, never actually stopped.

BTW, my spouse and I are fully vaccinated, and would opt for a booster of another vaccine if offered.

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Vaccinated, and have been since March. The one thing that worries me the most is this: the more people who get the virus, no matter how mild it is, the more opportunities for the virus to mutate. At some point, if the virus mutates into an entity that can overcome our vaccines, then we’ll be starting all over again.

For that reason, and that reason alone, I’m all for renewing mask mandates.

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Out of curiosity, approximately where do you live? That is, if in the US, which state? Or which county if you are comfortable posting that.

Just curious what amount of social media inspired “2 + 2 = 5” is manifesting in your neck of the woods. :upside_down_face:

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Maryland. I have no freakin’ idea what that math inequality of yours means.

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“2 + 2 = 5” is the most disturbing thing for me about this pandemic. It’s one thing to read about it in dystopian fiction. But to listen to interviews with people who effectively say,

Well, sure, they tell us that 2 + 2 = 4. But how do we know that’s really true? How do I know that 2 + 2 isn’t really 5? People online whom I trust are telling me 2 + 2 = 5. And that makes a lot of sense to me!

Currently perhaps a third or more of the US apparently embraces “2 + 2 = 5”. Knowing this disturbs me in ways that the novel alone never did. :scream:

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The next variant could be weaker. You never know with this stuff. Some say mask wearing has caused the virus to become more virulent in order to overcome it.

Remember at the beginning of this? We were told everyone will eventually get this, but we don’t want everyone to get it at one time.
Still makes sense. I think we should be protected as much as we can with vaccines and avoiding crowded events.

I really don’t see how we are going to do anything but push it off by all this new mask wearing mandates.

Variants will continue no matter what we do. Maybe we could have fewer but we will still have variants.

Masks are stopgap measures. We used them until vaccines were available. Now they are
I’m fine with campaigns to encourage vaccines , but at some point we need to let people suffer their own consequences.

You might say but that effects everyone, too, but there is no solution to that, we live in a world where people have different views. Even if they are politically motivated or fear motivated.

The new versions of vaccines will come every year like the flu shots. They will take into account the most likely variants.

I are ally think that’s all we can do in a practical sense

We are living in a social media world where “some say” is now considered as reliable, if not more reliable, than statistically controlled and peer reviewed medical studies. To me that is 2 + 2 = 5.

But that’s where we are now. And that’s why I fear humans will eventually destroy all life on this planet.

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I agree completely with your comment for people who are currently eligible for vaccines but are choosing not to take them. I think it’s very troubling that misinformation still influences them so much. Any kind of lockdown to protect them sounds preposterous to me- they need to wake up!

I think masking in places like grocery stores can be helpful to populations that are not currently eligible to receive vaccines - specifically kids.

Unfortunately, the delta variant appears to cause symptomatic infections in children at higher rates than prior versions of the virus. It also seems to cause more breakthrough infections based on comments from the CDC.

I’m not opposed to masking for now. Once kids are eligible to be vaccinated, my opinion may change.

Look, masking is such a small thing to protect yourself and others. And our hospitals are filling up again in certain areas and “elective” surgeries are being put on hold again because in some areas they are being overwhelmed.

So personally you want to stop all the infections you can, because right now you can get more nurses and doctors possibly from another area not as hard hit. That makes a difference for the vaccinated heart attack patient getting the care they need, the transplant patient surviving because the vaccinations aren’t working and the kids that might end up with complications down the road. Last time around a bunch of our nurses flew to NY to help. Now our state hospitals are filling up and we have one of the highest vaccination rates.

Kids are getting hit more, I think it’s the same percent as adults now? Part of that is because it’s the biggest group of unvaccinated people out there so more are going to get it with the more contagious variant. Our doctor in charge of the health department has stated that kids that get covid and have no symptoms can still have long haul covid problems. Who wants that for their children?

So many people seem to want to act like life is normal if we behave like it is. Life is still not normal yet, hopefully we will have a better normal at some point. I enjoyed the more freedom for a while, but I can put things on hold until things settle down again. But I have never stopped wearing a mask and our state actually still requires it. For one reason we can’t stop all the idiots that insist they still vacay during a pandemic.

I expect a more normal after unfortunately a whole bunch of unvaccinated people have gotten sick.

What we are going to do is prop up the fence sitters. Sooner or later the chips must fall where they may. At this point time 99% of the people that get Cov-id are unvaccinated.

I get it, we all have the right to refuse the vaccine but if you make that decision you must own it.

My understanding is that the data we have at the moment shows that the people who suffer seriously from the covid Delta variant are 99% unvaccinated.

Surprisingly though, both the vaccinated and unvaccinated can be “infected” with covid Delta. The difference is that the fully vaccinated are unlikely to get sick enough to require hospitalization.

As with any vaccine, being vaccinated does not give you an absolute guarantee of safety. But your chances are much better if you are vaccinated.

Then again, people often express such compelling reasons for not needing the vaccine such as, “I never get sick”. :man_facepalming:

Sometimes. But actually it tends to vary. There are certainly reports of unvaccinated folk who come back from near death, but still think the vaccines are “too new to be trusted”. Apparently the vaccinated, especially mRNA vaccines, could face complications a decade or two down the road. Because 2 + 2 really could be 5. :frowning_face:

At this time for them it is a moot point, why change your opinion, you have been, for all intents and purposes, vaccinated by the virus itself. Still if you are not vaccinated you are responsible, with few exceptions, if you come down with a severe covid illness.

In my way of seeing things 2 + 2 will never equal 5. If 5 is the answer then someone has mis-stated the equation.

I apologize in advance if posting the link to this story is too political. Feel free to either ask me to delete it or just go ahead and admin remove it if that’s the appropriate action to take.

The story itself is nothing remarkable. It is dated four days ago Tuesday so it’s not particularly timely. And this is not the first time I’ve seen stories such as this about “Lake of the Ozarks”. It was just something someone’s “algorithm” routed my way because it fits the parameters of my personal “info bubble”. :woozy_face:

It resonated with me because, well, a whole lake full of people who apparently believe that “2 + 2 = 5”. :man_facepalming:

It begins with the partial quote below:

… Erin, a bartender at Backwater Jack’s, couldn’t be in a more vulnerable position. She interacts closely with hundreds of maskless customers — sometimes on a single day. She knows most of them are probably not vaccinated. And she doesn’t care. She isn’t either.

“I’m living, breathing proof — I’ve not been sick once. I’ve been as hands-on as you can be with people from everywhere,” Erin said … She said she’d heard a rumor — common among vaccine skeptics but also plainly false — that “more people are dying from getting the vaccine this week.”

“Personally,” Erin added, “I feel like my immune system is doing a good job, so why pump it full of something that we don’t really know what it is?”

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Vaccinated people are still much less likely to be infected with delta than unvaccinated people - per the CDC.

Infections in fully vaccinated people (breakthrough infections) happen in only a small proportion of people who are fully vaccinated, even with the Delta variant. Moreover, when these infections occur among vaccinated people, they tend to be mild. However, preliminary evidence suggests that fully vaccinated people who do become infected with the Delta variant can be infectious and can spread the virus to others.”

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